Network licensing

[mpawlak]

What are the software/hardware requirements for network licensing of IronCAD?

 

Am I correct in understanding that IronCAD can only be installed on one machine per codeword with 5.0? That because of hardware fingerprinting the "honor system" floating license will no longer work? What about commuter licenses?

 

 

[Chris Lohman]

With 5.0 we have introduced a new licensing mechanism. Here's how it works:

 

For IronCAD you can purchase a "Per Seat" license, or a floating license that is tied to a license manager.

 

When 5.0 arrives it is pre-activated for 30 days. For 30 days it will run from the first time IronCAD was run, not the first time it was installed.

 

You will receive a serial # and codeword. Those are now used to "Activate" your product. When you activate your product, it will send the serial and codeword up to our server. Our server will then generate a license and send it to you in an email as an attachment. You will save that attachment to your local disk and then run it. (double click on it). When you run it, it installs your license. That license now only works on that one system. If you ever need to change systems, hardware, etc, give us a call and we'll help transition the license. We can also activate licenses via fax instead of internet.

 

If you have a single user IronCAD license, you can also purchase a commuter license for very little. This will allow you to install on one other piece of hardware.

 

For companies with higher numbers of users you can also purchase a license manager for concurrent instead of named licenses. If you have 10 people that need to use IronCAD, but only 3 of them will ever use IronCAD at the same time, you could purchase a license server and then purchase a few concurrent licenses so that everyone can share licenses across the network. The concurrent licenses would still have a hardware lock but would be tied to the server instead of the client.

[mpawlak]

Well, that's what I was afraid of, and it's a little disappointing. We currently have 2 licenses and 3 part-time users on 3 machines. We'll have to either buy another seat or buy software/equipment to run a license server. I was trying to determine which option would be more cost effective; that's why I was requesting the requirements for the license server. Is it restricted to a Win2000 server like TeamVault?

[Chris Lohman]

I'm trying to gather some info on the license server. A license server isn't a seperate physical piece of hardware, it's simply a server application that runs on some other windows box. So you should be able to run it on one of your workstations. I'll post more information when I obtain it.

 

 

[mpawlak]

Running the license server from an existing NT workstation would be ideal. Thanks looking into this.id='Arial'>

 

 

[Chris Lohman]

OK here's some more info:

 

The license server product that we use is called SentinelLM which is produced by Rainbow Technologies. Our license server is based on the SentinelLM but there are a few differences.

 

In general the license server will run on any Windows NT based system. So that's Windows NT and Windows 2000. It does not require the server version of those OS's, the workstation versions are fine.

 

The communication protocol that we support is TCP/IP.

 

So even if you're in an NT workgroup environment, with no domain and no servers, you should still be able to install the license server on any nt workstation and run it. The license server does tie itself down to the hardware so once you dedicate a box as the license server you have to stick with it.

 

 

[Guest Linas Martinenas]

How much is a commuter licence? The last time I have heard of it, you could only buy it at the same time as the main seat, but that was VDS days.

[mpawlak]

I have a pretty red and black certificate which entitles me to a Telecommuter License provided by Visionary Design Systems. Are these still valid? If so how does it work around the new security features?id='Arial'>

[Chris Lohman]

hmm....

 

The commuter license is $400

 

I'm checking on what they will do with old vds commuter licenses. That was two companies ago so...I dunno, I'll check...

[dsulli]

Chris,

 

I do believe that most other Mid-Range solid modelers offer free commuter use (SoliWorks does). I vote that IronCAD match this convenient bonus.

 

Dave

[Guest dlalonde]

Certainly for the faithful (aa subscribers) !

 

 

[Chris Lohman]

Here's the response from our OFD on what's going to happen with previously purchased telecommuter licenses from old Alventive or VDS days:

The theory on Telecommuter licenses has not changed. We have never charged AA for telecommuter. If the main product is supported, which his is, he automatically has the right to update his telecommuter with his main license. His record in Onyx reflects this and it looks like he is good to go with 5.0 for his main and TC license.

 

 

[kbell]

quote:Originally posted by dsulli :

Chris,

 

I do believe that most other Mid-Range solid modelers offer free commuter use (SoliWorks does). I vote that IronCAD match this convenient bonus.

 

Dave

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If solidworks offers this for free, you would think that Ironcad would. Being the little guy in the industry should make Ironcad more willing to work with us on this issue.

 

[Dave Parrish]

A small voice, perhaps, but I need to weigh-in on this topic.

 

I have been using the IC product since it was TriSpectives. Over the years, it has evolved into a pretty darn good design tool. It has taken a while, though and I have stuck with it through thick and thin... yes, there were some very trying times.

 

Every year, I ante-up my AA premium. However this year is different. It seems that there is a new wrinkle in the licensing scheme that prevents me from installing on my two machines unless I add a new "commuter" license fee.

 

It seems I am being punished for being a loyal, faithful user and promoter of IronCAD. The punishment is in the form of this extra fee for wanting to install IC on the extra computer that I use.

 

And, what, heaven forbid, would it take to also install it on my laptop so that I could take it to the customer's site for a meeting?

 

Should I be allowed to run more than one installation of IC under my existing license? I would certainly hope so... Other software, ie. SolidWorks and others, apparently allows this.

 

Is there anyone else in this boat with me? I'd like to hear from you, if you find yourself in similar situation.

 

Dave Parrish

Parrish Associates, Inc.

www.pai-design.com

 

Dave Parrish

Parrish Associates, Inc.

Wake Forest, NC 27588-0972

www.pai-design.com

 

[Ecurveman]

I use a laptop as my second computer too I hope to circumvent this microsoft mentality by using a pervious version of IC on my laptop

 

Bruce

 

 

[dsulli]

quote:Originally posted by dparrish:

A small voice, perhaps, but I need to weigh-in on this topic.

 

I have been using the IC product since it was TriSpectives. Over the years, it has evolved into a pretty darn good design tool. It has taken a while, though and I have stuck with it through thick and thin... yes, there were some very trying times.

 

Every year, I ante-up my AA premium. However this year is different. It seems that there is a new wrinkle in the licensing scheme that prevents me from installing on my two machines unless I add a new "commuter" license fee.

 

It seems I am being punished for being a loyal, faithful user and promoter of IronCAD. The punishment is in the form of this extra fee for wanting to install IC on the extra computer that I use.

 

And, what, heaven forbid, would it take to also install it on my laptop so that I could take it to the customer's site for a meeting?

 

Should I be allowed to run more than one installation of IC under my existing license? I would certainly hope so... Other software, ie. SolidWorks and others, apparently allows this.

 

Is there anyone else in this boat with me? I'd like to hear from you, if you find yourself in similar situation.

 

Dave Parrish

Parrish Associates, Inc.

www.pai-design.com

 

Dave Parrish

Parrish Associates, Inc.

Wake Forest, NC 27588-0972

www.pai-design.com

 

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It only makes sense to me that since you can't use more than one computer at a time, loading IC at home or on a laptop should be without extra charge. Many of us bring our work home and it surely would get tiring if we had to pack-up our PC to do so. I still believe that IronCAD is a great deal, but it sure would be nice if we could use it at home without having to pay extra $.

 

 

[Joe Walsh]

I would like to take a few moments to clarify network licensing for IRONCAD 5.0

 

IRONCAD is now available on a Named User basis or a Concurrent User basis. The Named User license is tied to a particular machine ID. The Concurrent User lisence is managed by a Network License Manager.

 

You can have any combination of Named User licenses and Concurrent User Licenses. The Network License Manager resides on a computer on the network and checks out licenses based on actual usage. A single Network License Manager can be used for both IRONCAD and INOVATE licenses.

Concurrent User seats must have access to the network to obtain a license. The software is loaded on each machine and obtains a license from the Network LIcense Manager.

 

There are two versions available of the Network License Manager. The first allows control of an unlimited number of concurrent users. The second is for smaller installations with a maximum of 5 concurrent users. Please contact your local channel partner or IronCAD for detailed pricing information.

 

The network licensing does not impact the telecommuter license. The Telecommuter is a unique offering from IronCAD allowing you to load IRONCAD on your home or laptop computer. This is available as acompanion for licenses that are current on Armor Advantage. There is a small one time fee and the Telecommuter stays current as long as the base license Armor Advantage is current.

 

We understand that the Network licensing is a change in licensing structure and would be happy to discuss your situation and transition to the new licensing structure. Please contact your local channel partner or IronCAD to discuss your particular situation.

 

Joe Walsh

VP, Worldwide Sales

IronCAD, LLC

 

 

[Guest dlalonde]

slam !

 

 

[mpawlak]

I just talked to our local "channel partner" who informed me that the smaller license server goes for $3750 plus $1250 per year maintenance above the IronCAD AA fee. That doesn't really make it cost effective for 3 part-time users sharing 2 licenses. Needless to say we'll be buying another seat - how clever of you IronCAD!

 

One of the reasons we went with IronCAD was that we were part time users, and that we'd have to re-learn Pro-E every other time we used it. Create Protrusion Extrude Done-Select Done Done Done. IronCAD was intuitive and easy-to-use, and didn't have formal license restrictions like our Pro-E designers did - perfect for us. We even bought a second seat after about a year because we were honorable. Well now I guess IronCAD is a bit more like Pro-E. Not a good thing.

 

I recognize you're well within your rights but is the company that strapped for cash that you need to aggravate long-time customers who would have previously recommended IronCAD without hesitation (almost)? You could've at least offered a server license at a reasonable price - < $500. I would think that until IronCAD is a more recognized name with a larger installed base you guys would concentrate on marketing and (useful) enhancements. You should've sent out the 30-day IronCAD trials to every CAD user out there, then made the cash from new customers. Most of the searches done on iccentral.com are for "free demo". Now hopefully you won't lose as many customers as the licenses you gain. Ok, done ranting.

[scharlton]

I go back to the days of Trispective and I love IC but I don't like the new licensing method. I loaded IC5 on my current PC and will soon be upgrading the PC. It will be a hassle loading it on the new PC. Maybe IC should use the dongle instead of the Microsoft Windows-XP method. I quess I will just stick with IC4.2 and not renew my AA.

[jmouser]

I had chimed in on this on an unrelated thread. Chris still found it and answered my question as follows:

 

When you purchase a commuter license we configure your serial and codeword to work with the product activation server twice. So just use your same serial and codeword on both systems, running through the activation wizard on each system, and it should allow you to activate two licenses.

 

My original question was:

 

Does anybody know how to load the commuter license with the new install registration process? I have a certificate that we bought from a VAR who's no longer around. That's all we got. A certificate. Does that sound right? Should there be some seperate codes or something?

Thanks.

 

*******

 

In my Gen-X opinion I believe that IronCAD's stance is right between that of a Pro/E and that of a SolidWorks 2000.

 

I heard that SolidWorks is tightening up security too however.

 

I'm not sure I understand the argument about having 2 licenses on 3 machines, with three users, and the 'part-time' qualifier, and this whole honor system thing. I've seen the honor system at work with software, and it's not a pretty site.

 

Seems to me like a commuter license or two would do MPawlak (and others) some good.

 

I spent some time with my previous Alventive VAR, and there were a lot of sales that got left on the table due to the fact that the lincenses weren't locked.

 

I believe that unlocking the software is a marketing strategy. I have frequently heard of the Microsoft model and the SolidWorks model for "commuter licensing". I am 100% convinced that these companies knew that the Napster* loving American's would pirate them like they're going out of style.

 

Why?

 

Market share. Get the people using it. Make it the standard. Then lock it up when you have them hooked. Notice the new security features on the Windows XP, and from what I've heard - SolidWorks.

 

John D. Mouser

JADIUM Corporation

 

 

* I know that both Microsoft & SolidWorks are pre-Napster companies. Please do not comment on that.

 

 

JADIUM Corporation is a pirate free organization. It is a real simple business plan. Pay the people who give us the tools to compete effectively so that we can continue the cycle of success. As the lovely sales lady at IronCAD will tell you I hold them fully accountable for their actions (and in-actions) as an Armour Advantage member.

 

This statement is not an endorsement for or against IronCAD.

Thanks for your time.

 

 

[mpawlak]

My argument for the 2 licenses on three machines is simple. As long as all three users were not running IC at once we could get along with two licenses. It was an imaginary floating license. We were told that this scenario was fine when we signed up with IC v2.0 (actually it was two users with one license then). Now we must buy a third license or a license server for the same price. Companies are not eager to approve purchases for items they thought they already owned, especially in this economic climate.

 

If IronCAD is so security and license conscious now, I doubt they would like us using a telecommuter license on our third machine.

 

I can't wait until the RIAA makes us buy a CD for each CD player we own.

[rfisk]

id='Trebuchet MS'>

Using IronCad from the Trispective days and all along staying an AA member, I also have a problem with the new security measures like D.Parrish wrote. Because of the one computer restriction, I have yet to install version 5.

For the past 8 years I have made a point to keep 2 computers on my desk. This started when I could not accept a small rush project because my computer was down. One computer is not even connected to a network or the internet. Due to buying cycles I always seem to have 2 different operating systems which are now 98 and NT. Like everyone else has experienced, they both crash or lock up and when that happens the other machine is right there to continue with little lose of productivity. Multitasking on one machine isn't a functional reality with large files.

I have also had the need to load IronCad on a notebook to take on overseas trips so I could make a presentation and offer changes in real time.

It comes down to 1 person-1 license, used where that person is working at any given time. Sliding over 2 feet to the other computer doesn't seem like a commute to me.

 

 

[Guest Scott Wallis]

My situation is exactly the same as rfisk's, just about word for word. I have other software that uses a hardware key "dongle" so I can run it on any computer I want. It seems much simpler and it gives me the feeling of actually owning the software I paid so much for rather than that I am borrowing it with all kinds of restrictions on where I can use it. Can you offer a dongle as an option for those of us who would prefer it?

[tlymneos]

I also use IC on two computer/operating systems like rfisk. My copy of IC 5.0 remains in the envelope uninstalled. IronCAD LLC should rethink its license policy.