Paper Space vs Model Space vs ICD

[tlehnhaeuser]

Excuse my ignorance on this subject, I haven't used AutoCAD in over 25 years!

 

I am trying to figure out what the advantages are for using CAXA Draft and deal with all the overhead of monkeying around between Paper/Model Space, Scales, DimScales etc... when ICD does it for me automatically.

 

Am I missing some major advantage somehwere?

 

I welcome any feedback.

Tx

Tom

 

 

[jolizon590016]

Hi Tom,

 

Happy Holidays. Model space comes handy if you want to add a 2D detail which may not be associative with your 3D>2D view model. But if you got everything on ICD, I will also use it most of the time.

[Mike Hatch]

We use both, probably 90% IronCAD, 10% Caxa Draft, with a caveat.

 

We have a large archive of AutoCAD 2d drawings going back 35+years for product still in the field, still manufactured and supported (Science industry) so we regularly use CAXA Draft for the archive, its similarity to AutoCAD makes it a breeze.

 

In 2009 we went over to IronCAD having evaluated several packages and never looked back. All new projects are IronCAD but CAXA Draft has its place, not for new projects though.

[tlehnhaeuser]

Thanks you Gentlemen,

This helps me a great deal. Happy Holidays to you as well.

t

[fhunt]

Excuse my ignorance on this subject, I haven't used AutoCAD in over 25 years!

 

I am trying to figure out what the advantages are for using CAXA Draft and deal with all the overhead of monkeying around between Paper/Model Space, Scales, DimScales etc... when ICD does it for me automatically.

 

Am I missing some major advantage somehwere?

 

I welcome any feedback.

Tx

Tom

48407[/snapback]

 

See my post (from a couple of days ago) in the CAXA draft forum.

[PWATSON]

I used autocadd 100% prior to adding Ironcad to the mix and still use it alot. For Me the similarities of Caxa and it's ability to seamlessly open autocad files was an obvious choice.

 

Here are my $.02.

 

In Autocadd I always use model space for 2d layouts all drawn at 1:1. I then utilize paper space to do my scaling and dimensioning and annotating ect.

 

Using CAXA draft this way when working with 3D doesn't work..(at least as far as i can tell) as the program is unable to place 3d views in model space and then have the paper and BOM in paper space (also known as Layout space). You cant itemize anything.

 

So for 3D caxa use I put everything in one space (for me paper space) and let Caxa take care of the scaling ect. This way there is only one dimension style, text size ect to deal with.

Essentially I use CAXA in the same manner as ICD

 

The only time i use Model space is to import some reference geometry ect.

 

I really don't feel there is a huge difference in the way the two programs Operate. There are some definite pluses to ICD when it comes to ease of view manipulation compared to Caxa and Caxa does some really weird things with View labels and ordinate dimensions ect, however I find there is much more flexibility in Caxa....sort of iphone vs samsung

 

 

cheers,

Peter

[tlehnhaeuser]

[using CAXA draft this way when working with 3D doesn't work..(at least as far as i can tell) ]

as the program is unable to place 3d views in model space and then have the paper and BOM in paper space (also known as Layout space). You cant itemize anything.

 

Thanks Peter

This is appreciated. FYI - Robert has done a nice overview on this subject and I think Caxa will do what you want with model space if I read this video correctly.

 

Cheers

Tom

 

[PWATSON]

Hi Tom..

 

That is a great video of how to use view ports and is exactly how view ports should be used and the way that Autocadd operates as well.

The only thing is you'll notice there was never a B.O.M. imported or any annotations added such as section views or details.

 

I suspect, from my experience, that is because CAXA Cant seem to handle having the B.O.M on the layout while the 3d views are in model space.

 

As well, you cannot create sections on layout space for items that are in model space. In order to create sections, you have to first create the sections in model space, but the caveat is that for the section annotation to be displayed properly when you go back to layout you must know what scale the viewport is at and then scale your annotations appropriately.

 

It really is a messy way to draw.

 

However, if you just pick a space...model or paper and drop your 3d views there and use the scaling function of the view creation dialog (ie set your scale at view placement) just like in ICD then let CAXA deal with the dimensions it all works nicely.

 

cheers

 

Peter

 

[PWATSON]

Hi Tom,

 

attached is a video i made of what i was trying to explain..

 

It would be interesting to get Roberts Take on this as I may be off in Left field here and just missing something.

 

I really like Caxa Draft but it has some very quirky parts which make me want to toss the whole computer out the window some days..

 

Cheers

Caxa_paper_model_space.mp4

[tlehnhaeuser]

Hi Tom,

 

attached is a video i made of what i was trying to explain..

 

It would be interesting to get Roberts Take on this as I may be off in Left field here and just missing something.

 

I really like Caxa Draft but it has some very quirky parts which make me want to toss the whole computer out the window some days..

 

Cheers

48448[/snapback]

 

 

Peter,

That video is great and helpful. However I guess I'm still confused. If CAXA Draft does exactly what you want in model space, then why do users still attempt to try and create drawings in Paper Space (layout). I know I'm missing something here, but my eyes are blurry these days :-). I know Joseph mentioned something but still cant wrap my head around his statement.

 

t

 

[PWATSON]

Tom

That is a great question and one I am hopeful someone smarter than I can answer.

 

I suspect its because Caxa is a 2D drafting program modified for 3D environment. In 2D drafting the paper space model space way of drawing works brilliantly and probably is the simplest way to depict multiple scaled views on one drawing. In a simple part drawing where there is only one scale then viewports aren't necessarily required and for 3D where the program does the scaling work for you view port drawing isn't needed.

 

The 2nd thing is that unlike ICD if you want multiple sheets you need to use the Layout tabs.

This unfortunately suffers the same problems as I described in my video, where if the B.O.M is not present on the same layout as your views you cant Itemize anything.

 

..Yet i still like CAXA. I really haven't used the ICD interface much so am really not even that familiar with any of it's idiosyncrasies. I bailed on ICD almost immediately as i tried to set up our company template file.

 

Cheers

[Malcolm Crowe]

Hi Tom (and others),

 

Unlike IRONCAD, SOLIDWORKS, INVENTOR etc... DWG Editors (like AUTOCAD) combine the "2D/3D Model" and the "2D Documentation" (annotated drawings) within a single DWG file.

 

Within this single file, "Model Space" is where you create the 2D or 3D model at a scale of 1:1. If you were creating a 2D model in CAXA then "Model Space" is where you would create it. You can consider "Model Space" as the equivalent of IRONCAD's 3D Scene. That is, where we create our 3D models (*.ics files).

 

"Layout Space" is all about creating the 2D documentation (or layout of the 2D drawing) as opposed to the 2D or 3D model. This includes, Drawing Frames, Title Blocks, Projected Views, BOM, Dimensions and other Annotations. In the case of DWG Editors, "View Ports" are inserted within "Layout Space" to create projected views of the 2D or 3D model that is located in "Model Space". These "View Ports" can be individually sized and scaled to create the desired drawing layout, to which the annotations are then added.

 

When creating 2D Models in CAXA, these should be created in "Model Space". When creating 2D Documentation (annotated drawings) in CAXA, then this should be done in "Layout Space".

 

In "Layout Space" of CAXA you have the option of inserting "View Ports" to project views of any 2D models you might have in "Model Space". Alternatively, you have the option to "Project Views" from IRONCAD 3D Scenes (including from multiple *.ics files).

 

Generally speaking all "Projected Views" of IRONCAD 3D models should be inserted into "Layout Space" and not "Model Space".

 

While the above is the general rule, attached is a video of an example where we have "Projected Views" from the 3D Scene into CAXA "Model Space". There were a couple of reasons for doing this. One reason was because we needed a single sectioned view on each "Layout Space" drawing sheet. So we "Projected" a Side Elevation of the 3D model into "Model Space". Then within "Model Space" (and using the sectioning tool) we created the various Sectioned Plan Views that we needed. Then in "Layout Space" we inserted "View Ports" to view the specific section views that we created in "Model Space". In this example we were also required to add some annotations within "Model Space". This is where annotation scales become important (which CAXA handles just fine).

 

Malcolm

CAXA___Projected_Views_in_Model_Space_with_View_Ports_in_Layout_Space.mp4

[Malcolm Crowe]

For those who like reference documents, attached is our updated in-house document regarding Model Space and Layout Space. The content is very similar to the post above.

Malcolm

 

 

IRONCAD DRAFT - Model Space and Layout Space - 20230523.pdf

Edited May 23, 2023 by Malcolm Crowe
Attached document updated.